Early vs. Late

All about The Smiths' music, gigs, stories, anything.

Postby elko » Thu Jun 16, 2005 8:59 pm

Okay, ignore the middle bit of The Smiths' career for a moment - which do you find more interesting, the early or late years of The Smiths?

Just something I was wondering, as personally the early albums, live bootlegs, interviews are much more interesting to me, just the way those songs were written seems far more exciting than anything they did after Hatful Of Hollow.

Excuse me if I'm rambling, or not even making a point.
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Postby tallulahtaurus » Thu Jun 16, 2005 11:17 pm

that makes thorough sense definitely early smiths...everything was better earlier on i'm afraid...!!
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Postby Still Ill » Thu Jun 16, 2005 11:56 pm

Can't say I've seen this anywhere else. Good unchartered territory. Definitely early, as that was the draw to begin with.
From the lyrics, even the early performances are different. But I suppose that could apply to a lot of bands first starting out. Can't add a lot more at the moment. Will have to consult my (ahem) Visual Documentary, that may inspire some more thoughts on this.
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Postby Miserable Liar » Sun Jun 19, 2005 12:03 pm

Lyrically and great music, 83/84 (ie. "Suffer little children", "That joke isn't funny anymore", great songs and such, 86/87 (ie. "Sheila, take a bow", "I started something I couldn't finish").
That's all I could think of to use as guidelines, but I chose 83/84.
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Postby rubygirl » Sun Jul 10, 2005 11:25 am

Thought it over again and again but still cannot make up my mind. Guess I am just equally interested in every single moment of The Smiths'existence - musically and lyrically.

It's an interesting idea for a poll though...
Last edited by rubygirl on Sun Jul 10, 2005 11:25 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Domestique » Sun Jul 10, 2005 11:33 am

I'm not choosing because I don't have to-how's that for a cop-out!

But this probably won't be my last word on the subject...
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Postby Machine22 » Fri Jul 15, 2005 2:28 pm

The early smiths seem more intense. Morrissey's singing is terrible at times, when he goes into the high pitched wailing, I feel slighly embarressed for him (e.g. at the end of misrable lie). However it captures a point in time much better than the later smiths. Any album with 'hand that rocks the cradle' and 'charming man' deserves to be held in high esteem. When you ever mention that you like the smiths people are most like to sing 'I would go out tonight but I haven't got a stitch to wear' (which has happened to me more than once). Strangeways is a poslished pop record but, I find it slightly boring and the worst smiths album. I always go back and listen to the smiths first album and almost never to stangeways, which I think answers the question.
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Postby Miserable Liar » Fri Jul 15, 2005 4:29 pm

Indeed, also, welcome to the board machine22!
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Postby Domestique » Sun Jul 17, 2005 5:59 pm

<!--QuoteBegin-Machine22+Jul 15 2005, 03:28 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Machine22 @ Jul 15 2005, 03:28 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->The early smiths seem more intense. Morrissey's singing is terrible at times, when he goes into the high pitched wailing, I feel slighly embarressed for him (e.g. at the end of misrable lie). However it captures a point in time much better than the later smiths. Any album with 'hand that rocks the cradle' and 'charming man' deserves to be held in high esteem. When you ever mention that you like the smiths people are most like to sing 'I would go out tonight but I haven't got a stitch to wear' (which has happened to me more than once).  Strangeways is a poslished pop record but, I find it slightly boring and the worst smiths album.  I always go back and listen to the smiths first album and almost never to stangeways, which I think answers the question.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Mike Joyce says Strangeways is his favourite Smiths album, Johnny Marr says it's the one he's most proud of-but then bands do tend to have a different perspective on their own work than fans. Me? I'm sitting on the fence-it has 5 brilliant tracks, 3 that'll do very nicely thank you, one sub-standard one, and the less said about Death At One's Elbow the better...

In terms of the general discussion re. early or late, I'd say that any variation in quality is minor. The material changed slightly over the course of their career, but that doesn't make it better or worse-just different. Which makes it merely a matter of personal choice which you prefer.

Having said that I must admit that my two least favourite Smiths singles both came from the final twelve months!
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Postby Truman Capote » Mon Jul 18, 2005 10:39 pm

I do not know, it was a very short lapse of time to see any difference, I mean, that kind of difference. I think that THE SMITHS made great albums, I like all of them and that`s why I do like them, I hate those bands with just one good record and a lot of bad albums.
Just see that when we are asked about the Smiths`songs that we hate, we just can name two or three songs.
So, early Smiths or Late Smiths, what difference does it make?
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Postby rubygirl » Mon Jul 25, 2005 11:39 am

<!--QuoteBegin-MISSERABLE+Jul 18 2005, 10:39 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (MISSERABLE @ Jul 18 2005, 10:39 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> I think that THE SMITHS made great albums, I like all of them and that`s why I do like them, I hate those bands with just one good record and a lot of bad albums.
Just see that when we are asked about the Smiths`songs that we hate, we just can name two or three songs.
So, early Smiths or Late Smiths, what difference does it make? <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Very well said! I couldn't agree more <!--emo&:P-->Image<!--endemo-->
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Postby chrisarclark » Mon Aug 01, 2005 5:14 am

<!--QuoteBegin-elko+Jun 16 2005, 08:58 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (elko @ Jun 16 2005, 08:58 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> which do you find more interesting, the early or late years of The Smiths? <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
more interesting? well, thats hard to say. imean, its all vividly interesting from the beginings to the demise. are we talking about the music or the story? and idont see why wed want to leave '85 out of the considerations- id lump the Meat Is Murder era in with the early. really, id say from May '82 to Aug '85 id look at being the "early" period and the "late" period for me starts with the release of "The Boy With The Thorn In His Side" in Sept '85 and goes through to the end of '87.

anyway, if we're talking the music and we're asking the question of "better" than its "late" hands down. if we're asking the question of "more interesting" then idont know if icould really say. theres far more questions surrounding the end than the start, but its a fabulous story of how things came together in the beginning.

ill vote "late".
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Postby tallulahtaurus » Mon Aug 01, 2005 6:01 pm

i think story wise and musically early is better but then I've said that...its just personally i can surmise for myself why they split...and its horrific not interesting just achingly horrid and sad stuff whereas the beginning, all those gigs where Morrissey and Marr used to dance together on stage and where Morrissey used to whip his top off on totp and used to wear women's shirts were just wonderfully joyous occasions in the bands history...

but then I am biased in that my favourite songs without possibility of question come from Meat is Murder and Hatful of Hollow (william, and that joke isn't funny) and my least favourite (girlfriend in a coma and there is a light) were off strangeways and the queen is dead....

different courses for horses...I just wanted to defend the earlier period in a coherent and explained sense...
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Postby Sammy » Fri Nov 04, 2005 1:59 am

You dont like "There Is A Light"? I think it's a great song!
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Postby Grim O'Grady » Fri Nov 04, 2005 11:59 am

I voted 'late' but that's because I'm going thru a 'Strangeways' era at the mo' but had I been on 'the Smiths' I'd have voted 'early' so like tallulahtaurus said <!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->different courses for horses<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->

love

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